Cleaning the carbs 1: Difference between revisions

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[[Category:Intake]]

~~There are 2 separate levels of~~ carb cleaning~~. The first level is if~~ you ~~have carbs~~ that ~~do work~~, ~~but~~ you ~~just think they're not~~ the ~~same as before/have lost some performance or smoothness, such as sitting for~~ a ~~while~~. ~~If you just want to try and improve the function a little bit, then using~~ Yamaha Carb Cleaner used to be ~~a good suggestion. However~~, ~~as environmental time marches on, the original formula of the Yamaha product~~ is no longer available. ~~There is a~~ [http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outdoor/apparel/apscitemdetail/3/124/all/all/322/detail.aspx Yamaha Carb Cleaner], ~~but it's~~ a water-based product that is less effective than the original. If your online store shows a bottle like the one on the left, they're using an old picture. The newer stuff looks like the right photo.

==Intro to carb cleaning==

If you clicked on this page thinking you were going to find some miracle product you could pour in your gas tank that would solve all your carburetor woes, you were mistaken. There is really no substitute for removing the carbs from the bike and giving them a proper hand cleaning.

The older formula of Yamaha Carb Cleaner used to be recommended in this space, but it is no longer available. Its replacement, also called [http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outdoor/apparel/apscitemdetail/3/124/all/all/322/detail.aspx Yamaha Carb Cleaner], is a water-based product that is less effective than the original. If your online store shows a bottle like the one on the left, they're using an old picture. The newer stuff looks like the right photo.

[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_1.JPG|150px]]

[[image:Yamaha carb cleaner.jpg|110px]]

~~Since this cleaner is not available any more, if you have any carb problems you might as well plan on removing and cleaning them properly. Keep reading.~~ The Yamaha Cleaner's main usefulness was always for loosening the crud inside the carbs, making the later hand cleaning a lot easier~~. The Berryman Chem Dip mentioned below is still available, but for the same environmental reasons you may have a hard time finding it~~.

The Yamaha Cleaner's main usefulness was always for loosening the crud inside the carbs, making the later (and necessary) hand cleaning a lot easier.

~~A little back~~-~~story on this stuff. In the 90's~~, ~~Yamaha made the mistake of fueling~~ up ~~their bikes as they rolled off the line in Japan. This means that the gas sat in tanks and~~ carbs for many months while the bikes crossed oceans and continents, then sat in showrooms and warehouses. Pretty soon, Yamaha dealers were flooding their techs with the need to clean the carbs, and this was all warranty work that Yamaha was paying for. To stop this flood of spending, they set some of their rather excellent chemists to the task of developing a cleaner.

==Pre-soaking, for really gooped-up carbs==

~~So to start, [[Draining the carbs|drain the carb bowls]] of gas, close the drain screws, and pour the mixture in. Use a small funnel:~~

====Pine-Sol method====

~~[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_2.JPG|150px]] [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_3.JPG|150px]]~~

~~Then, if you follow the directions, you'd drain and try starting after an hour or two... or just leave it to sit overnight.~~

~~An aside from loudboys:~~

*A good alternative is called [http://www.berrymanproducts.com/Default.aspx?tabid=~~146~~ Berryman Chem Dip]. It's absolutely the best carb cleaner on the planet. It comes in a gallon can; basically a paint can with an included basket to put the parts in and lower them into the can. I've been using this stuff for 25 years. You can take a carburetor that's been sitting in a junkyard for decades and clean it in an hour. The really great thing about it is that after you're done, you put the top back on and use it again later. A can of it will last for years.

====Berryman Chem Dip method====

:~~Of course~~, '''~~you~~ have to keep all rubber and paint well away from it~~'''~~ (including rubber o-rings, diaphragms and seals). Hard plastic parts won't be affected. You'll want to wear gloves when you use it.

loudboys says that [http://www.berrymanproducts.com/Default.aspx?tabid=146 Berryman Chem Dip] is the best carb cleaner on the planet. It comes in a gallon can; basically a paint can with an included basket to put the parts in and lower them into the can. He's been using it for 25 years. You can take a carburetor that's been sitting in a junkyard for decades and clean it in an hour. The really great thing about it is that after you're done, you put the top back on and use it again later. A can of it will last for years.

'''Notice''': You have to keep '''all rubber and paint''' well away from it (including rubber o-rings, diaphragms and seals). Hard plastic parts won't be affected. You'll want to wear gloves when you use it.

==Stuff you need and need to know==

Before you get started, take a look at the instructions for [[How do I remove the carbs to work on them?|removing the carbs]]. If you can't follow the FAQ to remove the carbs, then you probably aren't equipped to clean them.

~~First are the chemicals:~~

====Chemicals====

[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_4.JPG|150px]]

Line 29:

Line 34:

On the far right is a container of parts cleaner by [http://www.amrep.com/apg_product.aspx?ID=24 Next Dimension]. There is also a small amount in the Ragu glass jar on the far left. Next Dimension is highly recommended. Next to that is specific Carb Cleaner, by the same company. Spray cans of brake/parts cleaner work just fine as well. You DO need a spray can for this work. The last item, the open funnel/measuring cup, is the old Yamaha Carb Cleaner. Notice that it went from clear to green. It did its job.

~~Next we have the tools.~~

====Tools====

[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_5.JPG|150px]]

Line 59:

Line 64:

*One more: Drywall driver bits are great for JIS screw heads. Available at your local Home Depot or Ace Hardware. Whoever designed the drywall bit gave us a perfect JIS screwdriver substitute. They come in various sizes and they're cheap.

The following is ~~just~~ a picture of the float. It's what controls the level of fuel in the carbs~~....~~

====Carb parts====

The following are the different parts of a carb. Note that not all carbs look ''exactly'' the same. These are NOT EX250 carbs, and not even Keihins, but most carbs are similar to these.

This is a picture of the float. It's what controls the level of fuel in the carbs:

[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_8.JPG|150px]]

Line 65:

Line 74:

The floats do this by floating (duh?) on top of the gas and pushing the fuel needle against its seat. The fuel needle (shown below) should be inspected to ensure that the rubber tip is a well defined cone. If there's a dish in the middle, that means it's worn out and needs to be replaced. Worn needles will leak fuel into the carbs, which will then leak into the engine and flood it, as well as leak past the rings and contaminate the oil. Just a whole ball of wax best to avoid:

[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_9.JPG|150px]]

~~The following are the different parts of a carb. Note that not all carbs look ''exactly'' the same, but they're very similar and these are NOT EX250 carbs, and not even Keihins.~~

This is the main jet:

Line 80:

Line 87:

[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_12.JPG|150px]]

For more views of these parts, see [[Carburetor photos]].

==The cleaning process==

Remove all of the above items prior to cleaning, except the enrichener pickup; that's part of the carb body. This should leave you with just an empty looking float bowl (well, the top of that chamber, bottom of the carb itself). This is the 'meat' of the carb. Up top is just the slide and needle (which will be touched on later in this article). You need to probe each and every hole with some wire. Twist a few strands together for the big holes, and just use 1 piece, slightly kinked up, for the smaller holes. You want to be sure to get ALL of the holes, like these on the side of the pilot jet:

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 [[Category:Intake]]
-There are 2 separate levels of carb cleaning. The first level is if you have carbs that do work, but you just think they're not the same as before/have lost some performance or smoothness, such as sitting for a while. If you just want to try and improve the function a little bit, then using Yamaha Carb Cleaner used to be a good suggestion. However, as environmental time marches on, the original formula of the Yamaha product is no longer available. There is a [http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outdoor/apparel/apscitemdetail/3/124/all/all/322/detail.aspx Yamaha Carb Cleaner], but it's a water-based product that is less effective than the original. If your online store shows a bottle like the one on the left, they're using an old picture. The newer stuff looks like the right photo.
+==Intro to carb cleaning==
+If you clicked on this page thinking you were going to find some miracle product you could pour in your gas tank that would solve all your carburetor woes, you were mistaken. There is really no substitute for removing the carbs from the bike and giving them a proper hand cleaning.
+The older formula of Yamaha Carb Cleaner used to be recommended in this space, but it is no longer available. Its replacement, also called [http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outdoor/apparel/apscitemdetail/3/124/all/all/322/detail.aspx Yamaha Carb Cleaner], is a water-based product that is less effective than the original. If your online store shows a bottle like the one on the left, they're using an old picture. The newer stuff looks like the right photo.
 [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_1.JPG|150px]]
 [[image:Yamaha carb cleaner.jpg|110px]]
-Since this cleaner is not available any more, if you have any carb problems you might as well plan on removing and cleaning them properly. Keep reading. The Yamaha Cleaner's main usefulness was always for loosening the crud inside the carbs, making the later hand cleaning a lot easier. The Berryman Chem Dip mentioned below is still available, but for the same environmental reasons you may have a hard time finding it.
+The Yamaha Cleaner's main usefulness was always for loosening the crud inside the carbs, making the later (and necessary) hand cleaning a lot easier.
-A little back-story on this stuff. In the 90's, Yamaha made the mistake of fueling up their bikes as they rolled off the line in Japan. This means that the gas sat in tanks and carbs for many months while the bikes crossed oceans and continents, then sat in showrooms and warehouses. Pretty soon, Yamaha dealers were flooding their techs with the need to clean the carbs, and this was all warranty work that Yamaha was paying for. To stop this flood of spending, they set some of their rather excellent chemists to the task of developing a cleaner.
+==Pre-soaking, for really gooped-up carbs==
-So to start, [[Draining the carbs|drain the carb bowls]] of gas, close the drain screws, and pour the mixture in. Use a small funnel:
+====Pine-Sol method====
-[[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_2.JPG|150px]]  [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_3.JPG|150px]]
-Then, if you follow the directions, you'd drain and try starting after an hour or two... or just leave it to sit overnight.
-An aside from loudboys:
-*A good alternative is called [http://www.berrymanproducts.com/Default.aspx?tabid=146 Berryman Chem Dip]. It's absolutely the best carb cleaner on the planet. It comes in a gallon can; basically a paint can with an included basket to put the parts in and lower them into the can. I've been using this stuff for 25 years. You can take a carburetor that's been sitting in a junkyard for decades and clean it in an hour. The really great thing about it is that after you're done, you put the top back on and use it again later. A can of it will last for years.
+====Berryman Chem Dip method====
-:Of course, '''you have to keep all rubber and paint well away from it''' (including rubber o-rings, diaphragms and seals). Hard plastic parts won't be affected. You'll want to wear gloves when you use it.
+loudboys says that [http://www.berrymanproducts.com/Default.aspx?tabid=146 Berryman Chem Dip] is the best carb cleaner on the planet. It comes in a gallon can; basically a paint can with an included basket to put the parts in and lower them into the can. He's been using it for 25 years. You can take a carburetor that's been sitting in a junkyard for decades and clean it in an hour. The really great thing about it is that after you're done, you put the top back on and use it again later. A can of it will last for years.
+'''Notice''': You have to keep '''all rubber and paint''' well away from it (including rubber o-rings, diaphragms and seals). Hard plastic parts won't be affected. You'll want to wear gloves when you use it.
+==Stuff you need and need to know==
 Before you get started, take a look at the instructions for [[How do I remove the carbs to work on them?|removing the carbs]]. If you can't follow the FAQ to remove the carbs, then you probably aren't equipped to clean them.
-First are the chemicals:
+====Chemicals====
 [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_4.JPG|150px]]
@@ Line 29: / Line 34: @@
 On the far right is a container of parts cleaner by [http://www.amrep.com/apg_product.aspx?ID=24 Next Dimension]. There is also a small amount in the Ragu glass jar on the far left. Next Dimension is highly recommended. Next to that is specific Carb Cleaner, by the same company. Spray cans of brake/parts cleaner work just fine as well. You DO need a spray can for this work. The last item, the open funnel/measuring cup, is the old Yamaha Carb Cleaner. Notice that it went from clear to green. It did its job.
-Next we have the tools.
+====Tools====
 [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_5.JPG|150px]]
@@ Line 59: / Line 64: @@
 *One more: Drywall driver bits are great for JIS screw heads. Available at your local Home Depot or Ace Hardware. Whoever designed the drywall bit gave us a perfect JIS screwdriver substitute. They come in various sizes and they're cheap.
-The following is just a picture of the float. It's what controls the level of fuel in the carbs....
+====Carb parts====
+The following are the different parts of a carb. Note that not all carbs look ''exactly'' the same. These are NOT EX250 carbs, and not even Keihins, but most carbs are similar to these.
+This is a picture of the float. It's what controls the level of fuel in the carbs:
 [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_8.JPG|150px]]
@@ Line 65: / Line 74: @@
 The floats do this by floating (duh?) on top of the gas and pushing the fuel needle against its seat. The fuel needle (shown below) should be inspected to ensure that the rubber tip is a well defined cone. If there's a dish in the middle, that means it's worn out and needs to be replaced. Worn needles will leak fuel into the carbs, which will then leak into the engine and flood it, as well as leak past the rings and contaminate the oil. Just a whole ball of wax best to avoid:
 [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_9.JPG|150px]]
-The following are the different parts of a carb. Note that not all carbs look ''exactly'' the same, but they're very similar and these are NOT EX250 carbs, and not even Keihins.
 This is the main jet:
@@ Line 80: / Line 87: @@
 [[Image:Brian_Carb_Clean_12.JPG|150px]]
+For more views of these parts, see [[Carburetor photos]].
+==The cleaning process==
 Remove all of the above items prior to cleaning, except the enrichener pickup; that's part of the carb body. This should leave you with just an empty looking float bowl (well, the top of that chamber, bottom of the carb itself). This is the 'meat' of the carb. Up top is just the slide and needle (which will be touched on later in this article). You need to probe each and every hole with some wire. Twist a few strands together for the big holes, and just use 1 piece, slightly kinked up, for the smaller holes. You want to be sure to get ALL of the holes, like these on the side of the pilot jet: